TL;DR: what are you trying to do right now that you can't already on the web?

i've followed the discussion about the web sucks with some interest.  i've spoken with a few people about it, and i've decided that i just don't understand what's being proposed.

i asked joe hewitt what exactly he was trying to accomplish.  his response: "anything that involves a camera, a microphone, or a video stream."  i responded that it's already possible, unless he's referring to mobile devices.  am i missing something here?

i can understand that the web feels like one giant bandaid.  i feel exactly the same way.  but you can do almost anything on the web that you want to right now, outside of accessing some of the native iphone functionality, for example. there are conflicting interests when you try and get specific about some of this stuff.

"browsers should throw standards out the window, just be innovative"

it's not my opinion, but i think most of the developers out there share this sentiment.  it's a hassle to build your product to work across different browsers.  i don't consider it being lazy, i just am not attracted to that scene.  i went through that in the 90s.  in order for me to be lazy, i need to actually want what the browser is offering, and then refuse to build for it.  otherwise it's just unnecessary to me.

i would guess that most people are drawn to iphone development because there are so many people using iphones.  cocoa and xcode are great tools to work with, but i don't think that's the primary reason a lot of developers are choosing to develop for the iphone.

i'll build something if it's cool but only works for one browser.  but that approach won't work for companies with a larger user base.  they now have to make every single change across different browsers, and possibly different versions within each browser.

"the web is dying"

i don't think the web is dying.  i think there's just more usage outside the web.

you may use facebook on your iphone, but you also use it on your laptop or desktop.  the only thing that happened with the proliferation of mobile devices is you're now able to use the applications more than you could have before.  so now when i'm standing in line at starbucks, i can write on a friend's wall.  but when i'm back at home on my computer, i'm still living in the browser.  i definitely don't use the browser as much while i'm on my phone, but that doesn't really take away from time i would be spending from my work/personal computer.

in order for the web to disappear, people have to get rid of their computers, because they live in their browsers on their computers.  maybe if the ipad replaces the laptop, that's possible.  but in a world where everyone uses an ipad to work from, i think they're still going to live in their browser.  are they going to launch the native wikipedia app every time they want to do a search there, or will they just open a new tab in their safari browser?  i would think the latter.

i think one example used was abc.  the argument is because the native app is better, people will end up going to abc.com far less often.  i doubt i'm going to pick up my iphone and open the abc app, when i'm here on my computer and could just open a new tab.  if the app is that much better on the iphone, maybe abc.com could benefit from a ui/ux redesign.  there's nothing on the iphone that makes it better which you can't already do on the web (including the ui elements, animation effects, gps awareness, etc).

i'm all for doing things a better way, but if people are going to rant, it'd be nice if they suggested something specific.  maybe write out their thoughts in an essay, because i can't understand it in 25 tweets.

it's nice to have a culture that isn't happy with the status quo.  but all of this doesn't really translate to anything productive if we can't at the end of the day actually do something to improve the web.  if someone is trying to create an interest in a new browser, you've got my attention and i'm eager to learn about it.  but beyond that, i wouldn't depend on the w3c to change their ways.

at the very least, i want to understand what's being proposed before i get behind it.  right now, i can't say that i really do.